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One of my dogs will not come back once let of the lead, he treats it as a game when attempting this, its took up to 4hrs on occasions to get him back this as had to be done by trickery but then he gets wise,he was trained along with his brother and used to do it but not anymore why???

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Have you done any basic 'come' training indoors with lots of titbits? If not, then maybe it is time to go back to the basics.
Do you go to training classes with them?
I see you have two of the same age. Try to do this basic training with each one separately and also take them out separately until they have learnt some form of obedience - with loads of treats, fuss and play from you. No grabbing, threatening or tricking - they are far too clever for that;-))

Good luck!
Thank you for that yes I have two they both were trained in the same way and everything was fine up to a couple of months ago the other one is great comes when called goes back on lead when its time no problems just Zac thinks when i call him to put lead on thats a que for us to chase him which we don't do, walk in opposite direction he follows but not near enough just in case we try to get him on lead, started just putting lead on in the home and rewarding him for wearing it, see how we go.
Hi Janet, hope your ok. Definatly time for a bit of bac to basics with Zac, once you've done a bit of "in house" training with him, take him to a field without Dandy and either have him on a lunge lead (normally used for horses) or an extendable lead, have lots of treats with you and a good whistle, let him go the length of the lead then blow the whistle and treat when he comes back, keep doing this untill he gets the idea of whistle means food. I'll message you my new number and you can call me if you want a more indepth explantion of this, but it worked for me with Jensen and even the others all learnt this very quickly. Give the boys a hug from me, can't believe its been 2 years already!! x
Nice one Sue. I hear myself all through the puppy classes "finger in the collar"
good stuff but watch the extendable lead. Its really sore on the hands if Zac decided to take off.

I like the whistle association with food because if his recall is pants he has heard you shout all sorts and isnt listening now. Even introduce the whistle for every single time you offer him food even a titbit and he will soon realise whistle means food - come running. Keep him hungry on walk so that you can entice him with food

If you have had him with someone else then chances are he came back along with the other one and hasnt actualy grasped the exercise

I laughed when you talked about trickery I was once lying on the sand dunes at Dirleton for half n hour waiting for Fergal to come near enough to grab him and it wasnt til I started to "cry" that he came up to see what was wrong!
you have to be quick at grabbing them from that position. Lying down on your stomach they will come and stick their nose in and you can just gently grab a bit of them!

Have you ever "run a dog down"? Not what it seems but a favourite way to get a huntng dog to recall

Same bossy Setter bitch has a terrific nose and she was a swine at recall if she thought there was something out there. I have seen me wait hours for her.

I was told to stop shouting and whistling and set off after her. not to run just keep the dog in your sights, wherever it goes you go and you dont stop . It can be quite quick or it can be about an hour but the dog will become deeply uncertain at your stalking behaviour and wil actualy return to you. Praise the dog, clip on the lead, walk home and say no more about it.

i had to run her down twice and she never failed on a recall again.
That is so funny Sue, & funny how I know how well it will work!
I thank everyone for there words of advice have been doing the training in the garden, fingers crossed few more days and its on the field here goes!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Ok... I am not an expert nor Have I achieved this with my setter. he still bugs me the heck out when we are out for a walk or whatever. and I partly blame it on his hunting instincts that have kicked in lightly, because if he seas any bird on the grass he just rushes of... no mater how far from me he is.... SO I can say and admit that his recall is nowhere where it should be according to my expectations.

So what I do.. this is just an opinion and what my breeder recomended.
As much as I hate treats and titbits, the breeder recommended them but I only did it for 2-3 times and only a treat or two on a walk of 1 hour. so maybe of 10 recalls he gets once or twice given a treat.
on top of that I run him on a big 6 meter line draging behind him. I stand on it. he stops, he wants to move forward, he sees that he cannot and sits. I crouch down and he looks at me. I have a Wistle (AChme from England 210.5) a blast 3 pips and clap my hands . he rushes to jump in my chest. I dont give him a pat and "gud boy" untill I sit him down next to me where he is calm. And then I give him good boy. and a small pat of 2 seconds.
Dont praise him too much as that in the canine world is seen as a subbmission. so a quick good boy is enough.

Remember that every command you request is to be complied with. if he doesnt comply walk to him pick him up bring him to the point where he should have been in and pat him. this is because you get your way no matter what. no remmeber not to run to him call him. just be calm and walk to him. that way he will see that you are serious and not playing just purshuing him no matter what you want give up. he will get the idea after a while.

also every command has to be giveen a command to release the previous command. so when you call him. he comes sits in front of you and stand there until you say "ok" or whatever you want to use. othewise he makes the decision thus you are back to square one.

start with small distractions and build it up. I preffer to do the recalls in places where there is walking forwards and backwards, such as walkway with fences on either side so that he cannot escape around me or run away easily. IF he comes he has to come to you stright away, and not circle around you so thats why I say go to places such as those walkways, at least untill you get a rock solid recall in those places and move on to more hyper place.
If you know he wont come back dont call him. and dont call him constantly every 5 second. If he comes when you say "come" give him a praise and let him go for 10-20 minutes. dont make it something that will become borring quickly.

have fun and patience.... Im still bustin myself out every walk.
You have to praise him when he comes back, no matter how long he stayed away.

Its hard to admit this to yourself but if your dog wont come back right away its cos you are B-o-r-i-n-g!!

So instead of wondering whether to praise him or not figure out things that will make him go... wait a minute.... my mum looks like she is having more fun than me..... MUM!!!!!
I used to "walk out" with a guy who got a young rescue GSD. It was a lovely dog, great nature but its recall was non existent!

We went down to Cramond in Edinburgh which is a long empty esplanade and I said just let him wander off and when he has disengaged take off running in the opposite direction!

He did... and the dog kept wandering on! After about five minutes all I could hear was heavy breathing and pounding feet and as my lovely partner past me he said " so!!! do you have any other f***** bright ideas"
I managed to get the dog trained!!

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