Information wanted - Exclusively Setters2024-03-29T14:20:55Zhttp://irishsetters.ning.com/forum/topics/information-wanted?commentId=865021%3AComment%3A131080&feed=yes&xn_auth=noBlame me, I think I got the i…tag:irishsetters.ning.com,2009-01-03:865021:Comment:1319852009-01-03T12:21:25.371ZChristiane Lohmannhttp://irishsetters.ning.com/profile/HorridoChristiane
Blame me, I think I got the infos from Norwegian Kennel Klub member, who have been very worried about it. But I forgot where to find them. As far as I remember it is:<br />
Int.Ch.B. (Int.Champ. Beaute/ Int.Champ of Beauty;-) = still the old title, needs a price on an official (now CAC called) trial, which has its rules registered by FCI<br />
Int.Sh.Ch. (Int.Show Champ) = new title for working dogs, but achievable without working merits.<br />
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NOW...as vice versa we have the Int.Ch.Tr. (int.Champ. de…
Blame me, I think I got the infos from Norwegian Kennel Klub member, who have been very worried about it. But I forgot where to find them. As far as I remember it is:<br />
Int.Ch.B. (Int.Champ. Beaute/ Int.Champ of Beauty;-) = still the old title, needs a price on an official (now CAC called) trial, which has its rules registered by FCI<br />
Int.Sh.Ch. (Int.Show Champ) = new title for working dogs, but achievable without working merits.<br />
<br />
NOW...as vice versa we have the Int.Ch.Tr. (int.Champ. de Travail/Int.Working Champ), where a dogs needs at least a VG from an international show. I wonder if FCI will now create another title for those dogs who fail to get a VG on show, but gave all tickets for Int.Ch.Tr......As we have show titles without working, maybe working titles without show will be interesting as well ???<br />
O.K. before those who don't know me closer, take this serious...IT IS NOT !!! To me it is horror scenario to separate those different pillars of the breed. It is confusing, all these di…tag:irishsetters.ning.com,2009-01-02:865021:Comment:1316642009-01-02T16:03:05.398ZSusan Stonehttp://irishsetters.ning.com/profile/SwissSusan
It is confusing, all these different rules depending on the country... But of course it is every country's right to make their own regulations for their own <u>national</u> title. When it comes to the FCI International Title all must follow the FCI regulations.<br />
In Switzerland it is the breed club who can decide on the qualifications needed for the <u>national</u> title, not the kennel club.
It is confusing, all these different rules depending on the country... But of course it is every country's right to make their own regulations for their own <u>national</u> title. When it comes to the FCI International Title all must follow the FCI regulations.<br />
In Switzerland it is the breed club who can decide on the qualifications needed for the <u>national</u> title, not the kennel club. i could not find any informat…tag:irishsetters.ning.com,2009-01-02:865021:Comment:1316632009-01-02T16:00:56.779ZLaura Kolbachhttp://irishsetters.ning.com/profile/paintedblue
i could not find any information either :-( wonder if there will be a new abreviation for the title without working certificate? or will it be the same title, just two possible ways to achieve it?<br />
btw, the hungarian field trials are also with CACT.
i could not find any information either :-( wonder if there will be a new abreviation for the title without working certificate? or will it be the same title, just two possible ways to achieve it?<br />
btw, the hungarian field trials are also with CACT. So far I have not found any d…tag:irishsetters.ning.com,2009-01-02:865021:Comment:1316612009-01-02T15:56:43.269ZSusan Stonehttp://irishsetters.ning.com/profile/SwissSusan
So far I have not found any details about the <b>new</b> Int. Sh. Ch. title on the FCI website - but I may be looking in all the wrong places. Nor have I received any official information from the swiss kennel club.<br />
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As to trials with CACT (Certificat d'Aptitude au Championnat de Travail) - well I don't know about other countries but as far as I know all the swiss field trials for Setters & Pointers are with CACT - the CACT is needed for the swiss title of working champion.
So far I have not found any details about the <b>new</b> Int. Sh. Ch. title on the FCI website - but I may be looking in all the wrong places. Nor have I received any official information from the swiss kennel club.<br />
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As to trials with CACT (Certificat d'Aptitude au Championnat de Travail) - well I don't know about other countries but as far as I know all the swiss field trials for Setters & Pointers are with CACT - the CACT is needed for the swiss title of working champion. Leen, before we run into misu…tag:irishsetters.ning.com,2009-01-02:865021:Comment:1316382009-01-02T15:01:25.925ZChristiane Lohmannhttp://irishsetters.ning.com/profile/HorridoChristiane
Leen, before we run into misunderstanding:<br />
I meant that a CQN does not count for any kind of working title !<br />
Surely it is great to have a CQN on any dog and it shows that this dog has the ability to WIN every FT competition, when trained properly.<br />
And yep, the CQN therefore is definately enough to qualify for any show champion title and I would every day prefer a CQN- dog before a 3rd price-dog ;-)))<br />
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Never would I minimized a CQN !!!<br />
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About the CAC's on FT, I was questioning, as it looks like…
Leen, before we run into misunderstanding:<br />
I meant that a CQN does not count for any kind of working title !<br />
Surely it is great to have a CQN on any dog and it shows that this dog has the ability to WIN every FT competition, when trained properly.<br />
And yep, the CQN therefore is definately enough to qualify for any show champion title and I would every day prefer a CQN- dog before a 3rd price-dog ;-)))<br />
<br />
Never would I minimized a CQN !!!<br />
<br />
About the CAC's on FT, I was questioning, as it looks like politics goes faster than reality. A CAC for FT makes only sense, when it is a ticket for a NATIONAL working champion..and I wonder how many countries give national working champion titles that ask for a CAC-win or placement in a CAC-FT.<br />
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@ Laura<br />
I think I read it on FCI hp. Aside their new Int.Sh Ch, they still have the old Int.Ch., as before with a 3rd price on trilas, but recently WITH a working test run with a CAC on national terms. And who gives CAC's on FT in europe ??? I wooooonder....<br />
Surely germans GS club does, but who else ? Laura - the Club page gave th…tag:irishsetters.ning.com,2009-01-02:865021:Comment:1316182009-01-02T12:57:25.772ZSilvia Lindner-Raehttp://irishsetters.ning.com/profile/SilviaLindnerRae
Laura - the Club page gave the FCI- issue from their magazine!. There are two different Interchampions: one with the working trial and one without - theoretically a dog can be IntCH and IntSHCH - it is like the Hungarian Show Champion, only that title was cancelled, wasn't it?
Laura - the Club page gave the FCI- issue from their magazine!. There are two different Interchampions: one with the working trial and one without - theoretically a dog can be IntCH and IntSHCH - it is like the Hungarian Show Champion, only that title was cancelled, wasn't it? double CAC award was only for…tag:irishsetters.ning.com,2009-01-02:865021:Comment:1316102009-01-02T12:22:25.469ZLaura Kolbachhttp://irishsetters.ning.com/profile/paintedblue
double CAC award was only for the WDS. otherwise only given from jaktklass.<br />
still don't understand why CQN gives you a champion title in Belgium.<br />
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Christiane, where can we read about the new Interchampion rules (official version)? I read on one of the Austrian Setter club sites (<a href="http://www.setterpointerverein.at">http://www.setterpointerverein.at</a>, check under news) that you can choose the option of NOT having a working trial from now on.
double CAC award was only for the WDS. otherwise only given from jaktklass.<br />
still don't understand why CQN gives you a champion title in Belgium.<br />
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Christiane, where can we read about the new Interchampion rules (official version)? I read on one of the Austrian Setter club sites (<a href="http://www.setterpointerverein.at">http://www.setterpointerverein.at</a>, check under news) that you can choose the option of NOT having a working trial from now on. Correct me if I am wrong. You…tag:irishsetters.ning.com,2009-01-02:865021:Comment:1316012009-01-02T12:06:09.762ZChristiane Lohmannhttp://irishsetters.ning.com/profile/HorridoChristiane
Correct me if I am wrong. You have in Sweden UK = junior class (dogs up to 2 ys.) and AK = open class (for older dogs), where it should be judged ONLY for performance. And then, if you get a 1st in AK you may start in VK (winner class), which is comeptition stake. You can start in lavland = fields or fjell = mountain or skog = wood.<br />
I see a difference between a scandinavian 1st price in AK and a EXCELLENT on a FCI trial. Chasing is regarded more from practical hunting point of view. Or behaving…
Correct me if I am wrong. You have in Sweden UK = junior class (dogs up to 2 ys.) and AK = open class (for older dogs), where it should be judged ONLY for performance. And then, if you get a 1st in AK you may start in VK (winner class), which is comeptition stake. You can start in lavland = fields or fjell = mountain or skog = wood.<br />
I see a difference between a scandinavian 1st price in AK and a EXCELLENT on a FCI trial. Chasing is regarded more from practical hunting point of view. Or behaving after birds fly off is handled VERY strict in central europe ! One step forwards is OUT.<br />
I have seen several Swedish Show Champs on SISK homepage. Are they 'no one' ? I thought them to have a true national champion title.<br />
And how about the CAC ? On the world dog show it was awarded twice for each sex. One for internediate/open/champion class and another one...for working class. It was detailed desxcribed by Kenneth Edh from SKK during the judges conference, but was that only special for the WDS perhaps ?<br />
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Finally, Germany will follow the new FCI rules for Inter Champ, that is a field trial result must be at least GOOD on a CAC-FT. I would like to hear more about this CAC on trials and what one can buy for it;-)))<br />
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And last but not least CQN is for a slip of at least 10 minutes of highest qualification (excellent) on a open FT, but dog fails in training aspects (chasing birds, chasing after shooting etc.). This is a kind of 'certificate of merit'. It does not count, but you can be proud of it;-))) Can be given to several dog in one trial...but is rare. Quite right - and some are qu…tag:irishsetters.ning.com,2009-01-01:865021:Comment:1314002009-01-01T15:35:02.107ZSusan Stonehttp://irishsetters.ning.com/profile/SwissSusan
Quite right - and some are quite restrictive, but not all.<br />
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So we have the ironic situation that we can win <b>loads</b> of CACs... but never make up a swiss champion due to the very restrictive rule of the 'very good' at a field trial run by the SPCS.<br />
(OK, there are exceptions...;o))
Quite right - and some are quite restrictive, but not all.<br />
<br />
So we have the ironic situation that we can win <b>loads</b> of CACs... but never make up a swiss champion due to the very restrictive rule of the 'very good' at a field trial run by the SPCS.<br />
(OK, there are exceptions...;o)) Silvia, you will be pleased t…tag:irishsetters.ning.com,2009-01-01:865021:Comment:1313862009-01-01T15:16:43.853ZSusan Stonehttp://irishsetters.ning.com/profile/SwissSusan
Silvia, you will be pleased to hear that a petition will be put to the AGM of the swiss setter & pointer club SPCS in mid Feb 09 suggesting to ease off this rule a bit...<br />
You are quite right that these rules make the swiss title practically impossible to obtain - I find this a shame as it means that many foreign exhibitors, like you, are not interested in coming to our shows.<br />
Actually, the test does not have to be done IN Switzerland - but it must be a test ORGANIZED by the SPCS - but as…
Silvia, you will be pleased to hear that a petition will be put to the AGM of the swiss setter & pointer club SPCS in mid Feb 09 suggesting to ease off this rule a bit...<br />
You are quite right that these rules make the swiss title practically impossible to obtain - I find this a shame as it means that many foreign exhibitors, like you, are not interested in coming to our shows.<br />
Actually, the test does not have to be done IN Switzerland - but it must be a test ORGANIZED by the SPCS - but as there are practically no field trials in Switzerland (with the exception of mountain trials). So the trials are run in Italy or France... making it all the more illogical;-)<br />
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Camilla, what you address is not really a bonus: we have CACs in every class now plus Junior-CAC and Veteran-CAC which means that with low entries you may suddenly find EVERY dog entered has won the CAC or Reserve-CAC... I find this has greatly downgraded the value of the CAC.