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What causes an Irish Setter to over reach in the show ring?

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May I also add that most of the contributers to this discussion are experienced breeders, successful exhibitors and respected judges who have tried to give you the benefit of their extensive knowledge. Sad that you don't seem to appreciate this.
By the way if you say that many Australian breeders would be horrified at the thought that Australia imports American dogs then what is Energiser in your pedigree.......scots mist?

'Even though Australia has adopted the UK Breed Standard breeders lean towards the American way of presentation and of course they import many dogs from the US'.

  Your words not mine, not some or many just breeders. Again I will point out that your generalistion is wrong.

Now I am horrified that I have had to correct you twice on this.

I respect and appreciate friendly well thought out, non agressive discussions from anyone. If you read back you will find I have thanked people for their knowledge many times Eva.

Then Rhonda, practice what you preach. I recall your comments to me as being far more personally discourteous from the onset. You have also been discourteous to others. You obviously regard yourself as an authority so really and truly is there anything left for you to learn. If you are really interested in furthering your knowledge and are interested in the breed standard then go onto my page and look throught the Forum discussions I have posted. There you will find an explaination of the Standard by Bill Rasbridge. If you are as genuine a scholar of the breed as you say you are then I hope you will find it useful.
I have been in this breed 40 years and have had a good amount of success so please do not take this as being disrespectful but your opinion of me will not cause me any sleepless nights. Sticks and stones lady.

Eva read again. The first discourteous comment start with 'Ladies.....' and yes it was yours. I have not called people names, I have not suggested people leave the breed, I have not told people to leave dogs and buy a car. I have however challenged these comments sometimes using humour. I am not blaming any one if I leave the computer to go to work or run the dogs or just live my life. Your generalisations and what you believe I think and post and what I believe  just amazes me, When you make it personal I have to sit here and think is this what the forum is about. Using your post to defend your self and correcting ideas that people are putting up about who you are.

I am not an authority check the first page. If this is an example of your posts personally I would not like to read other situations where you have attacked the person not commented on the subject matter.

I am sure you would like me to be prancing around saying I am a scholar but I haven't again your words, your imagination coming out in your post. Eva I am not calling any names this is not a sticks and stones situation.

All I am doing is correcting things that you make up about me in your posts and it is really off the subject and very repetitive. Interested in your knowledge about over reaching not your opinions on me.

Where is some discussion on over reaching in your post.



My comments on over reaching are on page three.  The explaination of the Breed Standard by Bill Rasbridge can be found in my posted discussions, easily accessed from my page or you can trawl through the Forum discussions, but that will take an aweful lot longer.  There are very many other really good discussions on breed points which you might also find of interest.  We all love this breed to distraction and have never ceased to find it fascinating, in all it's aspects.  We are all scholars.

Thank you Eva. I did follow the forum post at the time.

Very true Camilla......we have all been there and after many years in the breed it still manages to surprise us.   We never stop learning.  We soaked it in, like a sponge.  An open mind, that is the best policy.  I must admit when we first started we bowed to those with years of knowledge and experience, took their advice and learnt that way...........those were the days.........

Still interested in learning and open to good knowledge about the Irish Setter. Not the type to bow down to personal attacks and posted false impressions about me Eva and Camilla . If you learnt this from previous people that this is the way to behave I am saddened that you did not filter at the time.

Again no discussion of dog movement.

Rhonda, when you showed at The Victoria show, did you watch the other entries' movement, see those that over-reached, & then look at A the way they were shown, and B study the conformation of those dogs to see a physical reason for their movement.  The over-reaching may have been the result of the "Bullet Train" speed which appears to be the norm these days in the Setter ring (yes, we have it here in NZ as well!) OR was the over-reaching the result of straight front & very over-angulated rear? (also something that has become the norm over here)  OR a combination of both - excessive speed if often employed to "muddy the waters" as far as faulty movement is concerned (seen here all the time).

Micro-examination of one fault can lead to ignoring other, much more deleterious, faults. 

Shame that is what you see when you read the posts. A person who has spent a long time in Irish and has knowledge and experience  and uses it to discuss the subject is always wonderful to listen to and read. A person who uses this position to feel they have the authority to make personal attacks and belittle a subject matter such as over reaching is going to be challenged over the comments. There is no need to mention new people. Personal attacks and trying to create a false persona for someone should not be tolerated by any one in the breed.

Well I have learnt something new for today. As a still relative newbie to the gundog group, 8 years :-) and a new judge, I am always keen to read and learn.




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