liver shunts

[paul collins]

Hi Ronnie woke today and very sleepy and walking with limp not himself and off food.Took to emergency vet full check,said could be liver shunt have to have full blood test and xray Tuesday(after bank hols)

Has anyone else suffered with this?we only had him 1 week should we contact breeder?

All started when we changed his diet to Orijen puppy from pedigree puppy last Monday?vet said high protein could be causing toxins?He now on boiled chicken and rice.We have the KC 4weeks free insurance that the breeder gave us,anyone know if this will cover him if he needs surgery?

[paul collins]

we just put him straight onto chicken and rice,still so aggressive with everyone and no matter how many times we take him out he still wee on the floor.....

[Howard Glansfield]

If he is like a dog possesed .I doubt he has a liver shunt!

[Fran Griffin]

If it's not a liver shunt, I hope it's not what is going on with my dogs. That all started from puppy, and despite the breed club's silence on the issue, there appear to be a lot of them out there!

[paul collins]

Hi Fran what has your dog got?

[paul collins]

Hi we only had him 1 day before his first vaccination then roughly 5/6 days later he became ill,we did wonder if there was side effects.he is 9 weeks old 

[Fran Griffin]

Hmmmm which is exactly what happened with mine Paul.  Mine have a malapsorbption issue which has only taken the vets 7 years to discover. It was only one vet who was in the emergency services from Poland who was really on the ball and recognized what he was seeing.  I  don't know if you are on Facebook, but on the Irish Setter Lovers page someone started up a hypothyroid thread (as this is what they all developed eventually) and I did a detailed reply. I also did my own thread on the the problems too, so if you are on Facebook you might like to have a read up on those? Looking at the feedback I have had there, these auto-immune problems are far from rare, particularly the slight malabsorption issue which can lead to other problems.  The other thing I am picking up on is the connection to a large worm load with these dogs as puppies.  Looking back, all mine who developed gastrointestinal issues all had a large worm load as puppies, and some of the feedback I received on Facebook are suggesting the same thing too. Interestingly, my Setters who have not developed major problems appear to have been well wormed by the time they left their breeders.  I maybe wrong, but I am wondering if the worms are leaving long term issues.  If your vet doesn't find anything but symptoms persist, if you are in the U.K and can get to  Chester, there is a referral center there with a vet by the name of Ben Harris who really knows about Setter issues. It would be worthwhile asking for a referral to him. His parents were breeders, and still have Setters, also he has learned a great deal from being involved in the treatment of my dogs and seen how they have progressed.  Whatever, don't allow it to drag on. The sooner you can get to the bottom of what's going on, the better it will be long term. If it turns out to be liver shunt, and a mild one, they can be managed quite well and I have known dogs to lead long and happy lives. If it is more serious, then the surgeon at the RVC is supposed to be the tops not just in the U.K but in Europe so I have been told.  

[Howard Glansfield]

The video is very interesting and informative,it's long but I guess it has to be.

http://healthypets.mercola.com/sites/healthypets/archive/2011/02/01...

[Fran Griffin]

Good one Howard.

[Chantal McIlveen-Wright]

thanks for sharing this link Howard!!!   very interesting for me as my old boy was "suspected" to have an internal liver shunt at the age of 4 years. The fatty acid test, blood tests, etc. was definitely pointing to a shunt, but after many other exams at the animal hospital and 3 biopsies the consultant said it was not conclusive, and we still don't know what is the matter with him. Darwin is now 8 and a half, more the poet sniffing dog than a bouncing one, but still living happily although sleeping a lot.

[Andrea Owen]

Are you sure you are not all jumping to the wrong conclusions here? Both Merlin and Fergal had days as pups when they were sleepy, off foodand could not be bothered with anything, these were the days they did there growing, 

Following day back to normal, lively eating all in sight.

As for toilet training, as others have said routine is best, before and after meals, on waking and after a play sesion, I still stay with Fergal at 6 months when he goes out for a peee

. WE  have had minimlal

 Mess Nd both have been clean by end of week 2.

[Howard Glansfield]

Could be you are right,and I hope so, but Paul reported the vet's initial diagnosis.

[Andrea Owen]

It was an emergency vet though, and in my experience these tend to be the junior vets. A more experienced vet would do the bloodwork aand go through various posibilities with you. Liver shunts are rare, and  the dogs with them tend to fail to thrive, Ronnie looks fine for his age in the photos.