A good hip score?

[emma bell]

I just want to call on the knowledge of you who breed as to what is classed as a 'good' hip score?

 

Currently, Darcey has an endorsement on her, restricting me from breeding - well, I could but I wouldn't be able to KC register them.

 

When I bought her, her breeder said that she would lift it but only if she received a good hip score.

 

I'm only wanting to breed one, maybe two litters from her but I will be really knarked if she turns round and says no!

 

She's booked in for April so I just wanted to know in advance!

 

Thanks everyone :)

 

 

[Melinda Auld]

The score is given based on the degredation, angulation and other factors of the actual bones of the hip socket and ball.  As Eva has said above, each point of the hip to be measured is given a score out of 6.  The higher the score, the more degraded the hip - hence, the more likelihood that the dog will develop symptoms of HD.  In essence, however, any score over 0:0 IS HD.  It is the severity which is being scored.

 

It does not, however, stand to follow that a dog with a score higher than 0:0 will ever display symptoms of HD.  For breeders, therefore, scoring is merely an indicator that a particular dog or bitch may not be a good breeding prospect, based on the fact that they MAY OR MAY NOT pass on badly-made hips.

 

Environmental factors can also influence whether or not a dog may end up with HD.  It is thought that over-excercising young puppies can degrade the joints, causing HD which has nothing to do with inheritence from either parent.

[eva ciechonska]

Catherine.  I know of dogs who have been x-rayed at 7 and 8 years old and who have had very low hip scores so in all probability there should be no deterioration in your dog's hips other than through wear.  However it is not dysplasia that will affect a dog in old age, though if badly afflicted it can be a contributary factor.  It is arthiritis and similar degenerative bone conditions that inhibit mobility.  Obeisity will also be a contributing factor.

As I said before, I have known dogs with high hip scores show no signs of degeneration in old age but then they have not developed arthiritis.

We all try to strive for excellence and want to do the best by our dogs so that they do not suffer in old age but Margaret is right.  There is no difference in soundness between a dog with a 0-0 score and a 6-9 score, not even a 10-10 score.  We are scoring here out of a maximum total of 106 (53-53).  The degrees of measurement are infinitesimal.

It is great that your dog's sister also has a very low hip score.  Have any other siblings been scored?   That is where you can make an informed judgement on the progress of your breeding programme as regards good hips.

[Catherine Carter]

This is an extract taken from an article explaining why dogs may develop arthritis :

Hip Dysplasia is a mal-formed ball and socket joint. Due to the ball not being correctly aligned in the socket, irritation and inflammation occur. Calcium builds up and the condition becomes chronic as the muscles and tissues surrounding the dog’s joint begin to be affected. Hip dysplasia is a progressive, developmental problem of young dogs manifested as chronic osteoarthritis and will potentially affect the dog’s quality of life. Although there is no cure, by adopting changes in lifestyle, weight, nutrition and activity the dog can live comfortably for many years. Large breeds of dogs and working dogs can suffer more as greater stress is placed on their hips. This is usually an inherited disease mostly due to poorly selected breeding by less scrupulous dog breeders.

Picture showing a malformed and damaged joint

[Margaret Sierakowski]

My bitch who is 0:0 is 18 months and the dog who is 6:9 will be four this year

[emma bell]

Thank you everyone for your advise, I'll have to wait for the results and go from there.

 

Can anyone tell me how long it takes to get the results?

[eva ciechonska]

Leigh, the difference is not surprising. There are differences in conformation between siblings. One could have better shoulders than the other, or a better croup, tailset, head etc. This is not a precision product where they come out looking the same. With careful selection, hopefully, this would be reduced. It takes time.
Emma, I hip scored a dog last year and received the results within 3 weeks but this does vary. When I had Concept scored 5 years ago it took three months but I do believe it is now much quicker. Good luck!!

[Margaret Sierakowski]

The score normally comes back within a month, but depends on what time of the month the X rays are submitted.and when the panel are meeting

I had one back last summer within twelve days, the X rays must have arrived just before the panel sat

All the others ( I had five done last year) were back within the month

The exception is in the late summer, as I believe the panel doesnt sit in August, so there can be a backlog for the September panel meeting

[emma bell]

Thanks Margaret, I didn't realise it went to a panel!

[Margaret Sierakowski]

I think it is also a good idea to look at the nine components of the score.  If there is a high score on just one component, then it would be better to breed the dog with another one who has a low or zero score on that component, which avoids doubling up on a specific fault

[Sheree Parrish]

I don't want to put you off Emma, but we nearly lost Henry today, he had a reaction to the meds and his heartbeat slowed down to the point that they had to reverse the meds and not do the x-rays.  They had strict instructions from me not to proceed if, at any point, he was in danger, I'm lucky that they adhered to my wishes, they phoned me once they had reversed it to see if I wanted to try again, obviously the answer was no and I collected my lad at midday, he has just started to come round but I will never hip score again, so will never breed again either...it is just too dangerous, I lost a healthy 2 year old English Setter following a sedative, I thought it would never happen to me again.

There will be people, no doubt, that say I am scaremonging as hundreds of dogs are scored every day with no effects, but so be it, you asked me to let you know how I got on and I'm letting you know. :-) x

[Sherry Miller]

Sheree,

   I am glad they were able to reverse the sedation and that Henry is okay...what a scarey time for you both.

[Sheree Parrish]

Thanks Sherry, he had me worried last night, he came back to normal at about 6 this morning, I sat up with him all night just making sure he was still breathing, poor little lad x