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Due to problems accessing the AHT website Dr Nigel Holmes has kindly agreed to extend the "promotional code" for the South fo England Irish Setter Club until 31st August. Unfortunately the original code cannot still be used so a new one has had to  be issued and will have to be obtained again from the SEISCwebmaster. The AHT apologises for any inconvenience caused!

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Lynn, I am so sorry you plans haven't worked out for your girl. 

With the amount of work that goes into breed mate selection and pedigree analysis, plus now the additional consideration of the rcd4 status, I hope you will have success next season when you have had time to find the right stud dog.

I hope there are lots of dogs who test clear available at stud so that there is a good selection and gene diversity.

Sorry Mel....but the only problem I have is people jumping down my throat everytime I make a comment!

This forum is called 'discussions' unfortunately, it is anything but....

There will always be ****lickers on these sites....and if I was one I would be popular!!

(and I'm not referring to you by the way!)





Very good reply Wilko and, yes, the view of 99% of contributers to this site.

Val, when you have posted informed comments on forum discussions members have agreed with you, I have too but you seem to turn everything into a confrontation.  You goad people into retaliating.  If you don't want anyone jumping down your throat then please don't goad.  There is more than one way of skinning a cat.  Just because people don't agree with you doesn't make them a...lickers. Everyone has an opinion and is free to voice it.

Exactly Eva..... everyone has a opinion..

Unfortunately some of us are not 'free to voice it' before being pounced on for airing our views which we are perfectly entitiled to do!

I don't expect everyone to agree with me...that's not human nature and anyway they are NOT the ones I would term as ****lickers!

.......and you are so right, there is indeed more than one way to skin a cat!


Hi Val

In an ideal world, then this would be my thoughts, but it is again the ''throw the baby out with the bath water'' thing...if you have really important lines that can't be replicated any more..and you bitch say comes in Affected you can mate her to a clear dog, (without causing any more dogs to go blind) and in three generations you can have clear. but you will still have those precious lines, maybe your lifetimes work. I wish I could have done something like that with my lines back in the 70/80's but without DNA I had to start again, this is heartbreaking and with the science we have now I would have been able to keep my lines. (although in my circumstances it wouldn't have worked, because the problem I had was bloat, still no DNA for that, but it is a good analogy of what I am trying to say)...only for extreme circumstances would this kind of thing be done..but yes in an ideal world then clear to clear is the only way to go, but this is not an ideal world...just my opinion...

You have got to take into consideration your first and last...and the one in the middle makes 3 well it did when I went to school but perhaps I am totally wrong, I don't count very well either...but

1) Start with an affected animal, mate to clear

2) 100% carriers. mate to clear

3) 50% 50% test and use your clear

Three generations...when clearing lines with genetics you must take into consideration just what you are starting with Affected that is your FIRST generation...

Hi Dee,

Like I said to Lynn...thank you for explaining why you would do things differently.

It's nice to have a discussion with people who don't 'go off the deep end' just because someone does not always agree with them or understand their reasons for something.


Replying to Val:

With a worldwide problem in dogs in general it would be disastrous for the breed's genepool if all affected dogs & bitches were simply wiped off the map.  There are very valuable lines which (quite apart from the heartbreak for their breeders/owners) the breed as a whole simply cannot afford to lose.   As you do not breed but prefer to source dogs from breeders who have put their money where their mouths are, you cannot possibly understand this situation from a breeder's point of view.

Of course it is preferable to only use carriers & clears - all breeders understand that.  Any breeder using an affected dog will be experienced, know their genetics pedigree-wise, & are the ones who will assiduously DNA test all the puppies from such matings, plus DNA test their progeny, & so on.  If one has been breeding for many years then the ability to face adversity in all its forms is pretty well entrenched...  Therein lies the salvation of these valuable lines, in spite of everything.

Lynne  I have 1 lovely carrier   and 1 lovely  affected, nothing will change at our house, I have said all along they are still my lovely  naughty red ladies, although obviously  I will keep my eye  on Mhairi  (whoops   no pun intended)  and she WILL NOT  BE  bred from, but no reason to not breed from Grainne  as long as a clear mate is used ( with no other  problems) who will hopefully  compliment my line  and the progeny is tested

I have had the followig test results back from the AHT today which are as follows:-





I give permission for these results to be published on the seisc rcd4 result list

Still awaiting one more result!
Cannot seem to edit last .Spelling mistakes for following and Billionair!!!!

Great News from Ulrike, Jean, Camilla, Lyn and Collette on your results. 

There haven't been many affected publicised.  Am I being an optimist that there may not be many Affected being identified?  I hope so.




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