Outcross Programm

[Rachel]

I have an IRWS pup, (registered with the Irish Kennel Club)

The dutch "Raad van Beheer" won't issue a pedigree because our dog is from an

outcross programm.

Is this correct?

 

 

 

[Astrid Landsaat]

Maybe it is a good idea to contact the IKC about this. Hopefully they can do something for you.

[Ann Millington]

Wasn't the puppy born in the Netherlands from an FCI registered IRWS, sired by an FCI registered Irish Setter? 

I thought all FCI countries were in accord with the IKC programme.  Even the UK - which is excluded from the programme - has a system for identifying crossbreds and accepting them under KC Reciprocal Agreements.

Contact the IKC, Rachel, they should be able to sort it out for you.

[Margaret Sierakowski]

The UK wasn't "excluded " from the outcross programme. The breed club in the UK wrote to the IKC saying they objected to the plans for an outcross, which they considered to be unnecessary. The UK Kennel Club had no objections to the outcross, and wrote to the IKC to say registrations of dogs from the outcross would be accepted under their reciprocal agreement with the IKC. I have imported a dog puppy from the first litter to be born under the outcross programme ( a litter brother of Rachel's puppy), and he has been registered here in the UK, no fuss, no hassles, no problems. And a beautiful puppy he is too! A big strong , sturdy pup, very well constructed, strong bone, nice head and a lovely temperament. Tested clear for CLAD, VWD and PRA, Both parents health tested.  Couldn't have wished for anything better than this pup, hoping he produces offspring as good  as he is.

[Ann Millington]

Margaret, read the item on the Outcross Programme on the Irish IRWS Club Website - this is the original Programme information that caused the GB Club to question the IKC. - and resulted in some memorable exchanges on the subject

The current Programme on the IKC website shows several changes from the first edition - probably due to the representations from many other national KCs and IRWS clubs outside the FCI.

Of course you were able to registered your puppy with the UK KC "without fuss, hassle or problems". The IRWSCGB and the UK KC worked together for such a contingency - as in your case - and to enable UK IRWS owners to be able instantly to identify the crossbreds.

Please do not misrepresent the GB Club in so negative a manner.

[Margaret Sierakowski]

Not quite how I remember the exchanges on the subject of the IRWS outcross programme, but if you are saying that the IRWSCGB now support the outcross, well , that is very good news . Quite a change of direction .

[Ann Millington]

The IRWSCGB neither supports nor ignores the Irish Outcross Programme, but are pragmatic enough to work with our KC to be prepared when crossbred dogs are imported.  Hence your ease of registering your puppy - in contrast to the problem that Rachel has with registering hers in the country of its birth!!

The IRWSCGB is well aware of the genetic future of the IRWS and, when it is clearly deemed necessary, will implement a crossbreeding programme.

[Margaret Sierakowski]

I don't remember that any of the letters from breed clubs (UK, US, Canada)  to the IKC suggested  or asked for any changes or modifications  to the outcross programme proposals. They were simply against it. The IRWSCGB's response was very short, that they considered the outcross to be unnecessary, but didn't comment on any detail or ask for any changes. In fact the only request made from outside Ireland was from the UK Kennel Club who asked for the registrations to be clearly marked that dogs were from the first, second or third generation of the outcross programme - which the IKC were going to do anyway

[Ann Millington]

Margaret, this is getting tedious.

Just accept that you do not know everything about UK IRWS and the Breed Club.

[Margaret Sierakowski]

But probably more than you know about the outcross programme.

[Rachel]

Thank you Margaret for your "dig"work regarding the outcross Pallas Green programm.

I am still none the wiser.

The dutch Raad van Beheer in Amsterdam is still refusing to register Tejas.

I seem to be the only one so far sticking my neck out to rattle at the RvB cage.

It's like talking to a brick wall. So while I am still in the dark, PLEASE can some one direct me or, read my MESSAGE to any one in the "right"mind to help me at least.

My puppy is 6 months, reached puberty, and thinks he is The Hulk (;-)

Chews his way through the waste paper basket and tissue box, I am sure he get's enough fibres but hey I am only human......... and my puppy is a happy chappy.

So to all you out there trying to do the utmost...... help TEJAS to get registered in  The Netherlands.

 

Thank you

xx

[Astrid Landsaat]

Rachel, have you been in contact with the IKC? You will find their e-mail address at the bottom of this page.

[Margaret Sierakowski]

I see from her  letter in Our Dogs that Ann Millington claims that the IRWSCGB and the KC were working together eighteen months ago over the registration of imported dogs from the outcross programme. Can I point out that that the IKC had always intended that the papers of the outcross dogs would be clearly identified in the first three generations and that the KC and the IKC were agreed on this two years ago - at a time when the IRWSCGB were canvassing their members on the club website and at their breed show in 2011 to write to the IKC about their objections to the outcross programme? And Ann was constantly criticising and sniping at the outcross programme on internet groups.
But lets be positive, if this indicates a changing attitude to the outcross programme in the IRWSCGB,and that they now support and wish to facilitate the import of IRWS from the outcross programme, that is indeed progress
Still wondering about the motion put down at the recent breed club AGM that IRWS rescue should take no responsibility for "crossbreds"  bred under the outcross programme, even if they are registered as IRWS. What does that suggest about attitudes to the outcross?