" Could our setters suffer a genetic disaster"

[Angela Clarke]

I open this discussion from concern that if honesty and openness is not forthcoming, our beautiful Irish setters could once again be on the brink of genetic disaster in the near future, ( especially on problems where there are no genetic tests available).       

I love my setters, and I love yours too so don’t let this happen again, PLEASE.

                                                                                                                                                                          During the 1930`s, PRA began to appear in several prominent lines of Irish setters. As more and more, dogs became affected, PRA was widely debated over the next ten years. By 1940 it had been determined that PRA was indeed hereditary and would lead to partial and eventually total blindness.

By 1945 the problem had reached such proportions that The Kennel Club issued a ruling that no Irish setter could be registered or transferred without a signed statement declaring neither parents nor grandparents were actively affected with the disease, and that the dog in question had not produced a case of PRA.

Mr. Rasbridge, as secretary of the Irish setter Association, then devised a plan requiring test mating to identify carries and clear animals. Such a design was obviously not popular with the important breeders of that decade. As affected pups were identified, the breed was devastated with many champions, and other famous Irish setters retired after their test matings failed. In what may be the most energetic attempt to salvage any breed, conscientious Irish setter breeders  continued to test mate and clear their stock. The next ten years were spent rebuilding Irish setter lines and Kennels.Their efforts produced several influential dogs that carried the breed back from the brink of genetic disaster.

SOURSE; IRISH SETTER BY MARGARET WILLIAMS ( 2000 ) Pages 18-19

We are only a small number of setter lovers but we could make a difference if others follow, everthing has to start somewhere.

If we keep to the subject, we may learn so much more. Adding the source of any information posted will give more credibility to that post.

What do you think ?

[Catherine Carter]

So do you think L.C. James made a note of all these phone calls and letters? Did he inform any of the Breed Clubs in the UK? Do you think we could have access to this information? Was it published anywhere? How can one find out? I only started in the Breed in 1982 so this was before I read Our Dogs or Dog World.

[Henk ten Klooster]

Catherine, a few answers here, hopefully others can for your first three.

Most relevant publications of W.J. Rasbridge and L.C. James are in the breednotes, published in Our Dogs, years 1974 and 1975. They deal with epilepsy and bloat and suggest a percentage of near zero.   

Several cases on the continent (quote) deal with the kennel of the late vet Wim van Gemert in the Netherlands, Van Wolmerum. He warned breeders not to continue this lineage but his advice was neglected by more breeders.

[Georgina]

One would assume then that the SA setter wasn't suffering (and I mean suffer) from epilepsy, so this may be a bit of red herring.   Maybe she had been bitten by some sort of insect and had an adverse reaction.

[Henk ten Klooster]

Maybe, Georgina. A rise from incidental to breedtypical starts here. Setterfans with experience in decades following, please contribute! If there was/were a few studdogs those times with epilepsy, they can dive up not for our eyes but on very faraway extended pedigrees umpteen times due to inbreeding and we might still have instruments to repair the damage!

[Georgina]

Henk I can only hope that those who appear to have hijacked the two previous attempts to kill off this topic now want to join in positively and let us have their invaluable experience, sincerely hope they do.  United we stand, divided we fall!! 

[Henk ten Klooster]

Yes Georgina, if sources in postings above are right, the worst things in Irish setters started in the seventies and we can maybe still find answers as to where the misery started and maybe how we can prevent it. There may have been a wealth of knowledge gathered by the late Wim van Gemert for example. Bravo Angela for giving a survey for breeds future a new chance. Let's hope this time it will work.

[Angela Clarke]

Hi Jocelyn, I wrote a replie about 1/2 hour ago dont know were it went } any way you are right, what I should have put after that was " in the near future" I have now changed that, thank you for pointing this out because I dont believe that we are on the brink now, but cannt wait until we are, can we ?

[Henk ten Klooster]

Jocelyn, it is very positive that there are so many healthy & happy setters. But no doubt everyone wants more healthy & happy setters. If you check the UK Breed Health Survey 2011,

http://www.irishsetterhealth.info/content/2011-breed-health-survey

you will see that 13-15 % has bloat or epilepsy. This climbs to more than 25 %  if you add entropion, hipdisplasia and meagoesophagus. This does not list other problems. What is your opinion about that percentage?

Other cultures provide other percentages, varying enormously from 0.5 - 25 % in NL for epilepsy for example.

 

[Astrid Landsaat]

Well I am not Jocelyn but in my opinion these percentages are unacceptable!

[Henk ten Klooster]

100% clear!

[Astrid Landsaat]

Anne, did you read the survey? I guess not!

[Henk ten Klooster]

Ah, now I read your pure personal point, Anne. That's not within parameters of this topic. Still an answer. If you analyse extended pedigrees you will see that your remark is shortsighted. The Irish setter -whatever culture, whatever lineage, shares a lot. Are you advocating a total split? I guess you need to address the parentclub for Irish setters for that, that's in Ireland. Are you?