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Media highlight Irish setter as a sick animal

The image of the Irish setter got another big blow in Dutch media this week because a breeder was fined to pay 6000 euro for selling and subsequently denying primary epilepsy in a dog. Nearly all media, from national television to dailies and social media focused on this. Last year it was only television, now the impact is way broader. What do you think, is there a way to get out of this misery? And how?

http://www.eenvandaag.nl/binnenland/42311/bom_onder_fokbeleid_

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Permalink Reply by Torie Lancaster on January 9, 2013 at 5:04am

While you argue amongst yourselves....Im just so very, very sorry for Sam who had a very miserable and short life. I haven't read through all the case, just enough to know that Sam had to endure a lumbar puncture,scans,all sorts of tests and finally the poor dog was given peace

Permalink Reply by Margaret Sierakowski on January 9, 2013 at 6:38am

I'm not an Irish Setter breeder so not well informed about what Irish Setter breeders are actually doing to reduce the incidence of epilepsy in the breed. Do some breeders actually breed from dogs that have epilepsy? Do they avoid breeding from dogs that have epilepsy, but breed from related dogs from the same lines? How would you go about eliminating epilepsy from your lines, if it is there?

Permalink Reply by Georgina on January 9, 2013 at 7:17am

Margaret, Simply by being open and honest without fear of litigation, that's how. The breeder hasn't accepted the great sadness and pain Sam's people experienced. Totally insensitive. The breeder has probably travelled around the world, judged, met all sorts of people and had wonderful experiences all because he loved IS, showed them and rose through the ranks to his present position. And yet he wasn't humble enough to have accepted that there was a problem with Sam and it is this arrogance that can ruin a breed in the blink of an eye. Guarding their reputation and self importance at the cost of another living being. That is why he should feel ashamed, not that he had the misfortune to have a puppy who was ill but to not support and admit and advise.

Hopefully they don't breed from affected animals but I guess if there is "an old boys" club and secrecy is their mantra - who really knows.

Permalink Reply by Henk ten Klooster on January 9, 2013 at 7:18am

Good question, Margaret! Please contribute. Question for you: is there primary epilepsy in IRWS and if so in what numbers? Asking this, because one of my proposals for ISCN committee was a crossprogram IRWS x IRS. Thanks for any answers, this deals 100% with the topic!!!

Permalink Reply by Georgina on January 9, 2013 at 7:41am

Henk, I always thought that IRWS and IS were very closely linked and when the IRWS was restablished weren't there cross matings then but I could be oh so wrong?? I can't remember clearly now but it must have been around the 70s/80s when a pocket of IRWS were found in Ireland and forgive me if I'm wrong but I think that Joyce and Maurice Webb (Shannonlee) worked valliantly and tirelessly and great enthusiasm during this time. They may even have been the initiators on getting IRWS to where they are today. It may be worth contacting Joyce, her details will be in the Irish Setter Breeders Club because they also had a successful kennel of IS. Joyce will, I'm sure, have a view on what state healthwise IRWS are currently experiencing.

Permalink Reply by Henk ten Klooster on January 9, 2013 at 7:53am

Georgina, the working IRS in Ireland was made by crossing with IRWS. It was the first time in breeds history in Europe that new blood to the genepole was added. This may (but needs scientifical research) explain why reportedly epilepsy and bloat play no significant role in working IRS and their related IRWS. If so, a solution for problems could be a cross. As far as I know, most showgenepoles (American/European) have a relatively high percentage of primary epilepsy. That suggests shared sources way back.

Permalink Reply by Georgina on January 9, 2013 at 8:09am

Henk, Ah, that's interesting thanks. I'm getting a bit of a fossil now so memory a bit "come day, go day"!! I thought that there had been some "common ground".

I did read somewhere, sometime, that because there is such deterioration in various breeds that they may be reclassified. That is, all healthy setters be bred together, spaniels likewise, retrievers, pointers etc etc. The outcome of the matings would be just Setters, Spaniels, Retrievers, Pointers etc. An intriguing thought I think but daunting if that becomes the case isn't it. I guess it would be similar to "designer breeds" such labradoodles, cockerpoos, dorgies sprockers etc. Greed is the factor here because again they are being churned out with the belief that they are healthier animals but, of course, this isn't the case. Anyway I'll try not to digresssssssssssssssssssssssssss, sorry.

Permalink Reply by Henk ten Klooster on January 9, 2013 at 8:31am

Georgina, I was just thinking in print. Designer breeds is not the solution in my brain, but it sure is meanwhile in many other brains. Maybe it is a part of solution to analyse what happened in the fifties when the working IRS was restored in Ireland. And maybe comparison of extended pedigrees of families free from most defects now in IRS and those that have, might provide answers. And yes, maybe not....

Permalink Reply by Howard Glansfield on January 9, 2013 at 12:36pm

As a person with epilepsy I know it can be inherited but,in my case,there are no other epileptics in the family so I guess,as with dogs, there always has to be a first.I have to admit that I wouldn't have 'bred' myself and had children if my epilepsy had showed before my children were born but it didn't.

I am not sure what I am trying to say other that things happen outside anyone's control.

Permalink Reply by Georgina on January 9, 2013 at 7:20am

Torie it is terrible and when you write it thus it hurts doesn't it. I've personally had lp and it is agony, poor, poor Sam and probably 100s of other dogs.

You're not near the bush fires are you??? Keep safe.

Permalink Reply by Gillian Kennedy-Sloane on January 9, 2013 at 12:00pm