Conflict over COI

[Henk ten Klooster]

“A first step forward for future” is how the committee of the Dutch Irish setter club describes a proposal to forbid combinations for breeding with a higher coefficient of inbreeding (coi) than five. Reason is “a rise of inheritable defects” like epilepsy, showing a clear connection with COI above five. A group of mostly show breeders tries to prevent this new rule being accepted on the annual general meeting. They launch another proposal, maintaining freedom of breeders to breed above that maximum.
What is your opinion?

[Dee Rance]

Most 'animals' have had to have an 'injection' of fresh blood in their lines somewhere down the line, when there isn't many animals of that particular breed, you have to have something to enlarge the gene pool, as Henk says you are going to sacrifice health for 'purity' but the IRS is only a red version of the IRWS, they both have the same origins. Surly something like Harry, who is a red that came out red and white, or any of his descendants, would put an injection of 'his type' of genes into the IRWS this would still be the purity you are after???

[terry o leary]

So purity first,coi (health)later.No we want both,but we dont want a mish mash of English Setter/Irish setter crosses. We have brought the IRWS back from the brink of extinction without English Setter crosses and we dont want any English Setter blood from American "Red Setters: which are not true Irish Red Setters.Do you think that Ray O Dwyer would bred from one.He would not touch one with a forty foot pole.I have read you speaking highly of him,so I presume you would agree with him on this subject. The IRWS now has many FT CH INT FT CH Derby Winners and Breed CH all this without English Setters.I think the bred will survive and continue on its road to success without them.As for old songs I think we have been hearing the Harry song for too long,dont you think its time to give it a rest.I thank you for your concern for the breed and I hope we can all agree on the way forward for the breed.

[Dee Rance]

Sorry I know nothing about English Setters, I also think that once crossed always crossed but is there not enough out there to keep the lines pure?? I actually don't think that crossing is the 'only' way to go but this elitism as to English or Dutch or Scandinavian purity is it that one country has breed out the brains of the dog and Irish lines are THE ONLY lines that have brains??? thats how you get High COI in your lines by being blinkered as to ALL that is out there

[Henk ten Klooster]

So purity first,coi (health)later.No we want both, wrote O'Leary

Well all ears, how?

[terry o leary]

Henk I dont have all the answers,just just the aspirations but as you seem to know so much on the matter.I am sure the Club would listen to any advice you could give on this matter.I Perhaps you could email it to me if not I suppose we will just have to get the advice from the experts.

[Henk ten Klooster]

As for old songs I think we have been hearing the Harry song for too long,dont you think its time to give it a rest writes O'Leary

Yes tell us all about your new import. Dutch lines as well?

[terry o leary]

Hello Henk My name is Terry,as for my new import with Dutch Lines???I dont have a new import,so prehaps you could tell me what import you talking about.

[Henk ten Klooster]

We have brought the IRWS back from the brink of extinction without English Setter crosses writes O'Leary

Yes congratulations. Will we bet a bottle of whiskEy on this?: the "pure" IRWS just like the IRS has bloodhound or flat coated retriever, native USA setters (mismash English/Irish/Gordon setters) aso in their extended pedigrees? If you prove its not, the bottle of whiskEy is yours. If I prove it is, the bottle is mine. Now???

[terry o leary]

Henk I am all ears but remember what I said "We have brought the IRWS back from the brink of extinction without English Setter crosses" so not just stories, or theories handed down but actual proof ,If you can convince me,not only will I give you a bottle of whiskey,I help you drink it.PS Do you think Ray O Dwyer would use American Red Setter in his breeding.

[Kristina Brannlund Westin]

I have really tried to follow all discusions here, but it is quite hard not understanding all words. That Harry who is that and what have he done, can someone please explain this for me.

[Laura Kolbach]

there is a different topic on Harry. harry is the r/w irish born from red parents.

[Kristina Brannlund Westin]

Okey, Laura!
I will find it and read