Animal Protection: Stop inbreeding, open registries, ban unhealthy breeds, curtail shows

[Henk ten Klooster]

Ban unhealthy breeds, attack inbreeding by opening up of registries permanently, stop breed standard exaggeration, curtail shows.

That is the advice of the Animal Protection the Netherlands (Dierenbescherming). With more than 40% of purebred dogs something is wrong, states the organization. Main source of that according to Animal Protection: dogshows.

Most Dutch media were focusing on this these days, after broadcasting of the British documentary Pedigree Dogs Exposed on television.

How is that in your culture and what is your opinion?

[eva ciechonska]

Susan. So what would you have us do then - outcross all the time? As I know, to my cost, bringing in other lines brought me problems which I could not overcome so I had to draw a line under all my breeding programme and start again with a completely different line. And I have, successfully, with a lovely dog who is, selectively being used at stud and his happy, healthy daughter who is closely bred and, like her daddy, hip scored, genetically clear of PRA RCD1, CLAD etc. etc. Outcrossing has done me no good whatsoever and I am keeping my fingers crossed I can breed on from this line and produce healthier dogs next time. It would be interesting to know what the COI of wolf or wild dog families is. I don't know but am prepared to be educated by those who do. Incidentally, GDV occurs in crossbred dogs as well, in cats, in horses, sheep..................and to a greater extent than people realise.

[Susan Stone]

Eva, I am like you just trying to find the best way to breed healthy dogs.
I have no straight and simple answer but there is an excellent and very informative site called 'The Canine Diversity Project'.
I find the articles by John Amstrong easier to read than most articles on genetics. Especially the one called 'Population Genetics and Breeding'

[eva ciechonska]

Thank you for that Susan I will investigate.
I too read the ISBC summer Newsletter. By the end of it I was so depressed I just wanted to shoot myself!!! The ISBC has collected data on GDV before and it has not produced much. It smacks of yet another knee-jerk reaction to me. There is a world of difference between just collecting data and actually collecting and utilizing it as part of a research programme or establishing a DNA marker for a specific genetic problem. Data is useless if it just sits and vegetates in a breed club's archives. Call me a suspicious old sceptic but, unless the information is handled properly and impartially it can be open to abuse and I would prefer it's storage to be undertaken by a 3rd and unconnected party. Breeders have swiftly risen to the mark when the occasion has warranted it and provided blood samples, histories, pedigrees etc. (Swedish established DNA test for CLAD as an example). That is the best way forward and, for me, the right way to go about clearing genetic conditions.

[Susan Stone]

Eva, I am suprised the ISBC Newsletter had that effect on you. My reaction was very different - after many years of feeling the country with the 'key population' of Irish Setters worldwide seemed to be so uninterested in taking health matters seriously. Other similar breed clubs (English & Gordon Setters) had long since realized the importance of hip scoring and helath surveys whilst the Irish Setter fraternity was still maintaining 'this has nothing to do with genetics'.
The ISBC Newsletter to me marked the advent of times changing for the better and I can but congratulate the people responsible.

[eva ciechonska]

Dear Susan, feeling depressed about the Newsletter is totally different from being seriously concerned about health matters in the IS. On the contrary Irish Setter fraternity are increasingly hip scoring their dogs and are very aware of health problems. But writing about it is different from actually doing something about it. And I reiterate that collecting data and storing it for future research is useless to the present day dogs and the breeders who are trying to eradicate problems now.

[Susan Stone]

collecting data and storing it for future research is useless to the present day dogs

Present day dogs would be profiting today if the collecting of data for research had been done 20 years ago... Unfortunately I recollect that on previous occasions when breed clubs tried tried to collect relevant data, many breeders refused to participate and support was dismal. Even CLAD was only adressed thanks to breeders in Sweden becoming activ.
I trust times have changed and we are all working together for the benefit of the breed we love rather than criticising those who are making a real and valuable effort.
Merry Christmas to you and may the new year bring health to the breed we love.

[Garrech and Canagan]

Hi there,

I agree that neither breeder involved in this instance would deliberately breed a sick animal. Totally and utterly endorse this comment!
But if there were to be a "possible" or even "vaguely possible" inheritable health problem I would hope that a responsible breeder would err on the side of caution and not use a dog again.
Yes living with the pup is like sitting on the edge of a volcano and waiting for the next time for it to blow! I wouldn't wish it on anyone or any animal.

[Cheryl Gorey]

Hi Catherine, I am not a member of the ISBC (I live in Australia), but am keen to be of any assistance possible.

We are extremely keen not to just be seen to be collecting data. We need to get some action to achieve an outcome as soon as possible.

Can you please advise me of the process ie: how long is the data going to be collected for; timeframes for the next steps after the data collection period has elapsed. Have all owners/breeders in UK been requested to provide sampling from affected dogs, etc. Is there a project scope / timeline in this regard. What is the data colelction for? only GDV or is there a process for collection to incorporate MO, Epilepsy, GDV and/or what else?

I would really appreciate your advice if you are able to provide this, otherwise, can you please advise who is the appropriate person to be contacted as Eva has offered to make contact with the necessary secretaries. Thanks

[Catherine Carter]

Sorry Cheryl, my remark was not intended for people living away from the UK.....At the ISBC we have Lynne Dale who is in charge of all our Health matters. You can email her direct with everything you would want to know about health matters. her email address is [e-mail]
Already a few years ago she was collecting data for bloat as I remember bringing all my dogs to her for taking measurements , life style, and food regime and OF COURSE their pedigrees.....so this is not new.....at the moment we do not have a DNA test yet for bloat . Susan has just started another discussion quoting Lynn Dale and the ISBC's advice about breeding and bloat in the UK. Have a look there at what she says.....

[Cheryl Gorey]

Excellent, thanks Catherine. No offence taken and appreciate your advice.

I am keen to know what has happened with the data taken a few years ago as well as this current project. I will check if Eva wants to make this contact or otherwise I am happy to do this if Lynne is happy to provide the information to me. regards

[Catherine Carter]

You can go ahead and contact Lynn Dale direct....this is what she says in the newsletter received yesterday.

[eva ciechonska]

I can certainly make this contact for you Cheryl and will do so today if I get no response from Lynn to the email you sent her which you copied to me.
Susan, I totally agree, breeders should have been more responsive 20 years ago.